French President Emmanuel Macron sat down with ABC News’ David Muir for an exclusive interview, and the conversation covered a lot of ground — the Strait of Hormuz, the war, Trump’s social media posts, and even a monument in Paris.
The Strait of Hormuz
Macron’s main goal in meeting Trump on Monday was, in his words, “to find the right deal in order to open” the Strait of Hormuz. The waterway has been a flashpoint since the war began, with Iran holding a powerful card: the ability to close the strait.
Macron told Muir that when the conflict started, “the Iranian regime discovered they had this card in their hands.” He added that the situation “was probably underestimated, and today we have to fix this issue.”
When Muir asked whether that was a “blind spot” for Trump, Macron responded gently: “I will not here blame anybody. We are where we are. I think the U.S. — I mean, your country — is the one able to fix this issue, and we need you.”
No War, No Confrontation
Macron was explicit about the war itself. “Having a regime change by bombing a country is not something I think feasible,” he said. He added, “And for me, it’s not a good option, because it doesn’t work. And we did this mistake several times in the past decades.”
When Muir asked whether France would offer its military to help reopen the strait, Macron replied carefully: “I don’t want to engage in a confrontation with any country, but we are ready to be more engaged in order to protect some capacities in order to make this transit possible, yes.”
France’s Stance on War
Macron also addressed Trump’s complaints that “The U.S. is spending hundreds of billions of dollars, and [European allies] are not there for us.” He responded that France respects the U.S. and considers itself a “good ally.”
“But when you want to engage people, you strategize with them, and you ask them before launching a war, and we decided not to join this war because we considered, and I still consider, it was not the right option,” Macron said.
Russia and Ukraine
Macron warned of intensifying Russian threats towards Europe. When asked whether he believed Russian President Vladimir Putin when he said Russia has “no aggressive intentions,” Macron was direct: “No.”
“I don’t buy when President Putin say years ago he wanted peace and make peace. This is not true. And I don’t buy when he say he doesn’t — he’s not aggressive with — with Europeans. This is not true,” he said.
Macron told Muir he had a “very good discussion” with Trump about Russia’s war in Ukraine while in New York this week. “My conviction is that your president has a fair assessment now of the situation, that Russia is not delivering what they wanted, that Ukraine is resisting with a lot of bravery and innovation, and that we have to help them,” he said.
Asked about his relationship with Trump, Macron said they have a “very good” relationship, and while they sometimes disagree, “we have always been extremely frank to each other.” He said Ukraine is an area where he has been able to “convince” Trump, adding that “I think on Ukraine we worked very hard, a few of us.”
Trump’s Social Media Map
Muir asked about Trump’s recent post showing a map with the U.S. flag sprawling across North America, including French territories off the coast of Canada. “When asked about the map, you said, ‘People have strange ideas. They say strange things.’ Did you tell President Trump you thought it was strange?” he asked.
“Yes, several times,” Macron responded.
The exchange then turned to bigger issues. “Honestly, look at the situation today … We have a war in Ukraine which is existential for the European security. We have war in the Middle East … We have AI and all this technological race to, not to fix, but to coordinate and make sure that there is not a race to the worst between China and the U.S … .We have sufficient topics to be fixed. Let’s not create new conflicts and new tensions,” Macron told Muir.
AI and the Technological Race
As Trump calls AI fears a “hoax,” Macron takes the threat “very seriously.” He called for a global discussion on the rapidly developing technology.
“This is why we have to make it totally clear and to have visibility, cooperation, and build new regulation on these consequences,” he said.
He also made a distinction between a pause for the frontier model and innovation, and how to address misuses. “It should not be just the decision of the U.S. government,” he said. “It’s a necessity to have a proper discussion between [the] U.S., China, Europe, and the rest of the world … to deal with AI excesses and with AI risks for our economies and national securities.”
The Triumphal Arch
Muir asked Macron about Trump’s proposed “Triumphal Arch,” which Trump has said is inspired by the Arc de Triomphe in Paris.
“President Trump wants to build an arch in Washington. He says it’s gonna be like the one in Paris, but it’ll blow it away,” Muir asked.
Macron responded he has seen pictures of the proposed arch, and had discussed the Arc de Triomphe with President Trump “several times.” When Muir followed up, asking “Is it gonna blow it away?” the answer was a diplomatic shrug.
“No,” Macron said. “Paris will remain Paris and the Arc de Triomphe remain the Arc de Triomphe…These monuments are bigger than ourselves.”
A Diplomat’s Humor
Macron’s reaction to the map was measured. He told Muir that the U.S. flag spreading across North America was “strange,” but he framed it as a conversation they had already had. The real issue, he said, is that there are enough serious topics to fix without creating new ones.
“Let’s not create new conflicts and new tensions,” he told Muir.
The Policy Positions
The interview covered a wide range of topics, from military strategy to monument design. Macron offered measured criticism, acknowledged that the U.S. is the one able to fix the Hormuz issue, and kept the conversation pointed towards solutions rather than blame.
He did not lecture Trump. He did not agree with everything. He moved from the Strait of Hormuz to Ukraine to AI to monuments, always returning to the same point: there are real problems to fix, and the U.S. is the one that can fix them.
Macron’s message to Trump was simple: let’s fix the real problems first.
A Quick Comparison of Macron’s Positions
| Topic | Macron’s Position |
|---|---|
| Strait of Hormuz | Underestimated, the U.S. is the one able to fix it |
| War with Iran | Regime change by bombing is not feasible |
| Trump’s map post | Strange ideas, let’s not create new conflicts |
| Ukraine | Fair assessment, Russia is not delivering, Ukraine is resisting |
| AI | Risks are serious, need global discussion |
The interview showed Macron willing to criticize and willing to acknowledge American leadership, but always pointing towards cooperation and resolution.
Source material: “Macron tells ABC News' David Muir: 'Hormuz Strait was probably underestimated',” ABC News.
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